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#1: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-18 23:04:16 by go.spam

Hi All,

The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up - to
downshift I have to press the lever a bit against the center of the
mechanism, otherwise it just goes round doing nothing.

So assuming I will need a new rear shifter soon, and that my rear
derailer can handle a 9 speed cassete, should I upgrade to 9 speed -
I'm presently using 8 - or would that be a bad idea?

My concerns are:

1) possible need for much more adjusting of rear shifting - presently
I simply turn a knob on the rear derailer that pulls the cable, once
in a blue moon - and,

2) Durability of drivetrain components - I don't mind chainging my
chains more often, but I would like my cassete and chainring to last
just about as much - and

3) Can I still get an 8 speed fair quality shifter (MTB)?

Let the wise (experienced) man - and women, by all means - speak their
minds, please!

PS - I would like the extra cog on a 9 speed cassete, but still can
live with "only" 8 cogs :-P

Cheers,
jbr

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#2: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-18 23:20:23 by Rob Kleinschmidt

BigBen wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up -

And you're sure you wanted to post this to a motorcyle group ?
Apart from Spagthorpe, very few manufacturers have ever used
deraileurs.

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#3: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-19 08:09:54 by chateau.murraySPAMKILL

Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:

&gt; BigBen wrote:
&gt; &gt; Hi All,
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up -
&gt;
&gt; And you're sure you wanted to post this to a motorcyle group ?
&gt; Apart from Spagthorpe, very few manufacturers have ever used
&gt; deraileurs.

Didn't Spagthorpe pioneer the front derailleur? Six-speed, IIRC.


--
Trophy 1200 750SS CB400F CD250 Z650
GAGARPHOF#30 GHPOTHUF#1 BOTAFOT#60 ANORAK#06 YTC#3
BOF#30 WUSS#5 The bells, the bells.....

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#4: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-19 20:17:11 by Rob Kleinschmidt

The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt;
&gt; &gt; BigBen wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; Hi All,
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up -
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; And you're sure you wanted to post this to a motorcyle group ?
&gt; &gt; Apart from Spagthorpe, very few manufacturers have ever used
&gt; &gt; deraileurs.
&gt;
&gt; Didn't Spagthorpe pioneer the front derailleur? Six-speed, IIRC.

I thought that was for the variable speed cam drives.

Report this message

#5: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-19 20:52:08 by chateau.murraySPAMKILL

Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:

&gt; The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; &gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; BigBen wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Hi All,
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up -
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; And you're sure you wanted to post this to a motorcyle group ?
&gt; &gt; &gt; Apart from Spagthorpe, very few manufacturers have ever used
&gt; &gt; &gt; deraileurs.
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; Didn't Spagthorpe pioneer the front derailleur? Six-speed, IIRC.
&gt;
&gt; I thought that was for the variable speed cam drives.

Dammit, but you're right.

Did they ever get the variable valve size mechanism right? You know, the
one that opened and shut like a camera aperature?


--
Trophy 1200 750SS CB400F CD250 Z650
GAGARPHOF#30 GHPOTHUF#1 BOTAFOT#60 ANORAK#06 YTC#3
BOF#30 WUSS#5 The bells, the bells.....

Report this message

#6: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-19 21:37:58 by Rob Kleinschmidt

The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt;
&gt; &gt; The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; BigBen wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Hi All,
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up -
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; And you're sure you wanted to post this to a motorcyle group ?
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Apart from Spagthorpe, very few manufacturers have ever used
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; deraileurs.
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; Didn't Spagthorpe pioneer the front derailleur? Six-speed, IIRC.
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; I thought that was for the variable speed cam drives.
&gt;
&gt; Dammit, but you're right.
&gt;
&gt; Did they ever get the variable valve size mechanism right? You know, the
&gt; one that opened and shut like a camera aperature?

The deraileur driven exhaust worked brilliantly but the poppet
intake valves had a series of baffling baffling problems, so the
4/6/8 stroke never really did well on this side of the pond.

Report this message

#7: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-19 23:36:05 by chateau.murraySPAMKILL

Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:

&gt; The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; &gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; BigBen wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Hi All,
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up -
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; And you're sure you wanted to post this to a motorcyle group ?
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Apart from Spagthorpe, very few manufacturers have ever used
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; deraileurs.
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Didn't Spagthorpe pioneer the front derailleur? Six-speed, IIRC.
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; I thought that was for the variable speed cam drives.
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; Dammit, but you're right.
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; Did they ever get the variable valve size mechanism right? You know, the
&gt; &gt; one that opened and shut like a camera aperature?
&gt;
&gt; The deraileur driven exhaust worked brilliantly but the poppet
&gt; intake valves had a series of baffling baffling problems, so the
&gt; 4/6/8 stroke never really did well on this side of the pond.


Ah. In the UK we got the oval crankshaft model, which got round this
problem. The oval crank put the pistons at the highest point when the
ignition fired. It was designed to rotate twice before firing again - a
sort of big bang theory - but the cams needed to be oval as well,
obviously, and the steep lobes put extra stress on the valve springs.

So instead of valve springs they used an early desmodromic system.
Taglioni copied it for some Italian thing.



--
Trophy 1200 750SS CB400F CD250 Z650
GAGARPHOF#30 GHPOTHUF#1 BOTAFOT#60 ANORAK#06 YTC#3
BOF#30 WUSS#5 The bells, the bells.....

Report this message

#8: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-20 15:48:26 by GaZ

( chop )


I know this is a pisstake, but didn't a company called zevatek or zenithtec
or similar actually use one? Bridgestone used a variation on it on one of
their 1970's bikes having 2 sprockets on engine side, but time blurs the
eyes.

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#9: Re: To upgrade to 9 speed, or not?

Posted on 2006-07-20 20:21:47 by Rob Kleinschmidt

The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt;
&gt; &gt; The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; The Older Gentleman wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Rob Kleinschmidt &lt;<a href="mailto:Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com" target="_blank">Rkleinsch1216128&#64;aol.com</a>&gt; wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; BigBen wrote:
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Hi All,
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; The shifter for my rear derailer seems to be about to go belly up -
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; And you're sure you wanted to post this to a motorcyle group ?
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Apart from Spagthorpe, very few manufacturers have ever used
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; deraileurs.
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Didn't Spagthorpe pioneer the front derailleur? Six-speed, IIRC.
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; I thought that was for the variable speed cam drives.
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; Dammit, but you're right.
&gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; Did they ever get the variable valve size mechanism right? You know, the
&gt; &gt; &gt; one that opened and shut like a camera aperature?
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; The deraileur driven exhaust worked brilliantly but the poppet
&gt; &gt; intake valves had a series of baffling baffling problems, so the
&gt; &gt; 4/6/8 stroke never really did well on this side of the pond.
&gt;
&gt;
&gt; Ah. In the UK we got the oval crankshaft model, which got round this
&gt; problem. The oval crank put the pistons at the highest point when the
&gt; ignition fired. It was designed to rotate twice before firing again - a
&gt; sort of big bang theory - but the cams needed to be oval as well,
&gt; obviously, and the steep lobes put extra stress on the valve springs.

No kidding !! That's certainly an odd design for Spagthorpe.

&gt; So instead of valve springs they used an early desmodromic system.
&gt; Taglioni copied it for some Italian thing.

I still prefer the elegant simplicity of their older poppet exhaust
designs.

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