| Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454949] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 15:42 |
|
I'm trying to help repair a Mikuni carb from a 250 Blaster by phone. I
need a diagram of the carb to figure out what he is referring to when
we talk. Any online exploded views out there anywhere? I haven't found
one so far.
JohnF
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454950 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 15:56 |
|
I should have added that this has some sort of casting on top of the
carb with electronics attached. One of the things I need to find out
is if these have some kind of internal device that stops fuel flow in
some manner. He gets no fuel to the float bowl and says there is some
sort of tube from the opposite side on the fuel inlet running to a
case someplace and he can see what appears to be a torx screw down
inside the fuel inlet. I'm not familiar with what-ever they have done
to carbs since my newest bike is an '85 and, relatively, simple.
I don't know what year this is either, it's a blue one and he says
there is no tag on the steering head.
TIA
JohnF
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 13:42:05 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
wrote:
>I'm trying to help repair a Mikuni carb from a 250 Blaster by phone. I
>need a diagram of the carb to figure out what he is referring to when
>we talk. Any online exploded views out there anywhere? I haven't found
>one so far.
>
>JohnF
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454951 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 16:04 |
|
"JohnF" <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net> wrote in message
news:rdufj1pvql54nqrgrab99k78mm939j0fve [at] 4ax.com...
> I'm trying to help repair a Mikuni carb from a 250 Blaster by phone. I
> need a diagram of the carb to figure out what he is referring to when
> we talk. Any online exploded views out there anywhere? I haven't found
> one so far.
>
> JohnF
bikebandit.com
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454953 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 17:16 |
|
JohnF wrote:
> I should have added that this has some sort of casting on top of the
> carb with electronics attached.
I looked at the fiche for a 200cc Blaster and it has the throttle
position switch you describe. Apparently the throttle cable operates a
cable sector inside the case and the sector operates a switch that's
part of the emissions control system. Maybe it controls electronic
spark advance?
Tell him to trace out the wiring and see if it goes to an electronic
engine control unit.
> One of the things I need to find out
> is if these have some kind of internal device that stops fuel flow in
> some manner. He gets no fuel to the float bowl and says there is some
> sort of tube from the opposite side on the fuel inlet running to a
> case someplace and he can see what appears to be a torx screw down
> inside the fuel inlet. I'm not familiar with what-ever they have done
> to carbs since my newest bike is an '85 and, relatively, simple.
The "case" is probably a charcoal canister that's part of the
evaporative control system. The canister stores gasoline fumes when the
engine isn't running. The line your friend saw is probably the canister
purge hose that sucks gasoline fumes out of the canister when the
engine is started.
I recommend that your friend looks for a vacuum hose routing diagram
which may be underneath the seat or under a side cover to see what kind
of emissions control equipment has been installed on his machine.
An aftermarket repair manual would be a good source of info, too...
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454955 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 19:26 |
|
Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
JohnF
On 26 Sep 2005 08:16:13 -0700, "krusty kritter" <kriyamanna [at] aol.com>
wrote:
>
>JohnF wrote:
>> I should have added that this has some sort of casting on top of the
>> carb with electronics attached.
>
>I looked at the fiche for a 200cc Blaster and it has the throttle
>position switch you describe. Apparently the throttle cable operates a
>cable sector inside the case and the sector operates a switch that's
>part of the emissions control system. Maybe it controls electronic
>spark advance?
>
>Tell him to trace out the wiring and see if it goes to an electronic
>engine control unit.
>
>> One of the things I need to find out
>> is if these have some kind of internal device that stops fuel flow in
>> some manner. He gets no fuel to the float bowl and says there is some
>> sort of tube from the opposite side on the fuel inlet running to a
>> case someplace and he can see what appears to be a torx screw down
>> inside the fuel inlet. I'm not familiar with what-ever they have done
>> to carbs since my newest bike is an '85 and, relatively, simple.
>
>The "case" is probably a charcoal canister that's part of the
>evaporative control system. The canister stores gasoline fumes when the
>engine isn't running. The line your friend saw is probably the canister
>purge hose that sucks gasoline fumes out of the canister when the
>engine is started.
>
>I recommend that your friend looks for a vacuum hose routing diagram
>which may be underneath the seat or under a side cover to see what kind
>of emissions control equipment has been installed on his machine.
>
>An aftermarket repair manual would be a good source of info, too...
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454958 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 19:35 |
|
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 17:26:52 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
wrote:
>Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
>found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
>black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
>bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
>there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
I don't know squat about Blasters, but here's an idea:
Are there two hoses running off the petcock? Does the petcock have
"ON-RES-PRI" positions only (no OFF)?
If so, it is a vacuum operated petcock, needs vacuum from the engine
to flow fuel. Try it in the PRI (prime) position, should flow w/o
vacuum.
Maybe Murray will jump in here, he just went through some issues with
this type of petcock on his DR350.
>JohnF
David - 05 KTM 200EXC
djones<at>LSidaho.com
http://www.spodefest.net/rmd
http://www.spodefest.net/forum
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454974 ] |
Tue, 27 September 2005 05:17 |
|
JohnF wrote:
> Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
> found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
> black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
> bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
> there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
You can register to look at the fiche I looked at on
www.partsfish.com...
The fiche I looked at was for a 200cc Blaster, but it was just the
typical Mikuni VM slide valve carburetor that has been around since the
1960's.
I can't imagine Yamaha getting Mikuni to redesign the carb itself for a
fuel shutoff to meet EPA emissions requirements. I can imagine that
throttle position switch working with a power valve on a 2-stroke
engine, or controlling the ignition advance curve though...
The carb I looked at has a float and a float valve. If you let an
engine sit long enough for the fuel to evaporate out of the float bowl,
the gasoline will turn into gum and varnish and the gum will make the
float valve stick. Usually it sticks in the low position and the float
bowl overflows until the gum dissolves. But, I have see the float valve
stick in the up position, blocking fuel flow completely. Some carbs do
have little filters above the float valve seat, so your friend might
have seen something to do with the
filter. That thing that he thinks looks like a torx fastener may have
something to do with the float valve or a filter.
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #454977 ] |
Tue, 27 September 2005 05:35 |
|
krusty kritter wrote:
>
> You can register to look at the fiche I looked at on
> www.partsfish.com...
Go here: http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/parts/home.aspx No need to
register and much more complete. The
device you are referring to is a Yamaha feature called TORS, or throttle
overide system. It kills the engine if the slide does not return
properly when the throttle is released. There is no electric fuel
shutoff on a Blaster.
Jerry
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455038 ] |
Thu, 29 September 2005 01:50 |
|
I've had him do all the standard stuff to check for blockages. He had
the carb off and the bowl taken down to clean the fuzzzys out of the
jets. I had him spray Berrymans down the fuel line to see if it was
flowing at all but it wasn't. I looked at the Yamaha page and the carb
looks just like any other Mikuni since dirt so I have to assume there
is something in the float needle (small bird or the like) stopping the
flow. I'll be there tomorrow so I'll take a look.
Thanks for the help everybody.
JohnF
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455114 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 15:56 |
|
I should have added that this has some sort of casting on top of the
carb with electronics attached. One of the things I need to find out
is if these have some kind of internal device that stops fuel flow in
some manner. He gets no fuel to the float bowl and says there is some
sort of tube from the opposite side on the fuel inlet running to a
case someplace and he can see what appears to be a torx screw down
inside the fuel inlet. I'm not familiar with what-ever they have done
to carbs since my newest bike is an '85 and, relatively, simple.
I don't know what year this is either, it's a blue one and he says
there is no tag on the steering head.
TIA
JohnF
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 13:42:05 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
wrote:
>I'm trying to help repair a Mikuni carb from a 250 Blaster by phone. I
>need a diagram of the carb to figure out what he is referring to when
>we talk. Any online exploded views out there anywhere? I haven't found
>one so far.
>
>JohnF
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455115 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 16:00 |
|
In article <rdufj1pvql54nqrgrab99k78mm939j0fve [at] 4ax.com>,
mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net wrote:
> I'm trying to help repair a Mikuni carb from a 250 Blaster by phone. I
> need a diagram of the carb to figure out what he is referring to when
> we talk. Any online exploded views out there anywhere? I haven't found
> one so far.
Try going to the Yamaha US web site. They have all the parts diagrams
going back several years online.
I'd also try the alt.atv newsgroups. This being a motorcycle newsgroup,
qwads aren't given much tolerance here ;) (<-- winky smiley crap)
--
Charles
'99 YZ250
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455116 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 16:04 |
|
"JohnF" <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net> wrote in message
news:rdufj1pvql54nqrgrab99k78mm939j0fve [at] 4ax.com...
> I'm trying to help repair a Mikuni carb from a 250 Blaster by phone. I
> need a diagram of the carb to figure out what he is referring to when
> we talk. Any online exploded views out there anywhere? I haven't found
> one so far.
>
> JohnF
bikebandit.com
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455126 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 16:57 |
|
Thanks, guys
I been a skooter-pilot since a dirt bike was a Yamaha Big
Bear/Catalina with an up pipe but you gotta help family.
JohnF
Yamaha US web site
bikebandit
'76 TT-500
'85 IT-200
'82 Seca
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455128 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 17:16 |
|
JohnF wrote:
> I should have added that this has some sort of casting on top of the
> carb with electronics attached.
I looked at the fiche for a 200cc Blaster and it has the throttle
position switch you describe. Apparently the throttle cable operates a
cable sector inside the case and the sector operates a switch that's
part of the emissions control system. Maybe it controls electronic
spark advance?
Tell him to trace out the wiring and see if it goes to an electronic
engine control unit.
> One of the things I need to find out
> is if these have some kind of internal device that stops fuel flow in
> some manner. He gets no fuel to the float bowl and says there is some
> sort of tube from the opposite side on the fuel inlet running to a
> case someplace and he can see what appears to be a torx screw down
> inside the fuel inlet. I'm not familiar with what-ever they have done
> to carbs since my newest bike is an '85 and, relatively, simple.
The "case" is probably a charcoal canister that's part of the
evaporative control system. The canister stores gasoline fumes when the
engine isn't running. The line your friend saw is probably the canister
purge hose that sucks gasoline fumes out of the canister when the
engine is started.
I recommend that your friend looks for a vacuum hose routing diagram
which may be underneath the seat or under a side cover to see what kind
of emissions control equipment has been installed on his machine.
An aftermarket repair manual would be a good source of info, too...
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455132 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 17:22 |
|
Way back when, I used to have a Big Bear/Catalina Scrambler, used to
ride it on mostly logging roads to hunt deer with my dad, who rode a
Trailmaster 100(YL2C) back then.
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455137 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 17:43 |
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I'd rip off all that carb smog crap off the bike and toss it. Start
with a fresh unit like a holley and go from there.
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455152 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 18:57 |
|
A 1968 YL2CM Trailmaster 100 was my first real dirt bike.
Yellow and Chrome.
It had two rear sprockets, attached, to alter gearing, with extra
section on chain and master link in the tool kit (from the factory).
I learned a lot on that bike.
Jim
************************************************************ *****
>On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 15:22:58 GMT, Chris Buckley <cnbuckley [at] earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>Way back when, I used to have a Big Bear/Catalina Scrambler, used to
>ride it on mostly logging roads to hunt deer with my dad, who rode a
>Trailmaster 100(YL2C) back then.
************************************************************ *
Jim Cook
'04 Gas Gas DE300 Woods Pilot
Team LAGNAF
SMACKOVER RACING
BJEC/SERA/TSCEC/AHSCS
www.smackovermotorsports.com
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455157 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 18:50 |
|
My dad bought 2 of them new in 1967 from a Yamaha dealer in San
Francisco that he knew very well. The price out the door for the both of
them was $600.00(total). They were handy bikes, electric start, dual
rear sprockets, oil injection, reliable as hell too!!! As I recall, the
shift pattern was 4-down.
Chris
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455162 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 19:26 |
|
Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
JohnF
On 26 Sep 2005 08:16:13 -0700, "krusty kritter" <kriyamanna [at] aol.com>
wrote:
>
>JohnF wrote:
>> I should have added that this has some sort of casting on top of the
>> carb with electronics attached.
>
>I looked at the fiche for a 200cc Blaster and it has the throttle
>position switch you describe. Apparently the throttle cable operates a
>cable sector inside the case and the sector operates a switch that's
>part of the emissions control system. Maybe it controls electronic
>spark advance?
>
>Tell him to trace out the wiring and see if it goes to an electronic
>engine control unit.
>
>> One of the things I need to find out
>> is if these have some kind of internal device that stops fuel flow in
>> some manner. He gets no fuel to the float bowl and says there is some
>> sort of tube from the opposite side on the fuel inlet running to a
>> case someplace and he can see what appears to be a torx screw down
>> inside the fuel inlet. I'm not familiar with what-ever they have done
>> to carbs since my newest bike is an '85 and, relatively, simple.
>
>The "case" is probably a charcoal canister that's part of the
>evaporative control system. The canister stores gasoline fumes when the
>engine isn't running. The line your friend saw is probably the canister
>purge hose that sucks gasoline fumes out of the canister when the
>engine is started.
>
>I recommend that your friend looks for a vacuum hose routing diagram
>which may be underneath the seat or under a side cover to see what kind
>of emissions control equipment has been installed on his machine.
>
>An aftermarket repair manual would be a good source of info, too...
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455164 ] |
Mon, 26 September 2005 19:35 |
|
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 17:26:52 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
wrote:
>Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
>found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
>black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
>bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
>there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
I don't know squat about Blasters, but here's an idea:
Are there two hoses running off the petcock? Does the petcock have
"ON-RES-PRI" positions only (no OFF)?
If so, it is a vacuum operated petcock, needs vacuum from the engine
to flow fuel. Try it in the PRI (prime) position, should flow w/o
vacuum.
Maybe Murray will jump in here, he just went through some issues with
this type of petcock on his DR350.
>JohnF
David - 05 KTM 200EXC
djones<at>LSidaho.com
http://www.spodefest.net/rmd
http://www.spodefest.net/forum
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455242 ] |
Tue, 27 September 2005 05:17 |
|
JohnF wrote:
> Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
> found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
> black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
> bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
> there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
You can register to look at the fiche I looked at on
www.partsfish.com...
The fiche I looked at was for a 200cc Blaster, but it was just the
typical Mikuni VM slide valve carburetor that has been around since the
1960's.
I can't imagine Yamaha getting Mikuni to redesign the carb itself for a
fuel shutoff to meet EPA emissions requirements. I can imagine that
throttle position switch working with a power valve on a 2-stroke
engine, or controlling the ignition advance curve though...
The carb I looked at has a float and a float valve. If you let an
engine sit long enough for the fuel to evaporate out of the float bowl,
the gasoline will turn into gum and varnish and the gum will make the
float valve stick. Usually it sticks in the low position and the float
bowl overflows until the gum dissolves. But, I have see the float valve
stick in the up position, blocking fuel flow completely. Some carbs do
have little filters above the float valve seat, so your friend might
have seen something to do with the
filter. That thing that he thinks looks like a torx fastener may have
something to do with the float valve or a filter.
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455244 ] |
Tue, 27 September 2005 05:35 |
|
krusty kritter wrote:
>
> You can register to look at the fiche I looked at on
> www.partsfish.com...
Go here: http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/parts/home.aspx No need to
register and much more complete. The
device you are referring to is a Yamaha feature called TORS, or throttle
overide system. It kills the engine if the slide does not return
properly when the throttle is released. There is no electric fuel
shutoff on a Blaster.
Jerry
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455262 ] |
Tue, 27 September 2005 13:51 |
|
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 13:56:50 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
wrote:
>I should have added that this has some sort of casting on top of the
>carb with electronics attached. One of the things I need to find out
>is if these have some kind of internal device that stops fuel flow in
>some manner. He gets no fuel to the float bowl and says there is some
>sort of tube from the opposite side on the fuel inlet running to a
>case someplace and he can see what appears to be a torx screw down
>inside the fuel inlet. I'm not familiar with what-ever they have done
>to carbs since my newest bike is an '85 and, relatively, simple.
First things first, pull the plug on the bottom of the float bowl,
turn on the petcock, if gas guns out, your getting gas, if not,
disconnect the fuel line at the petcock, again turn on the petcock and
see if gas flows from the tank, if it does you need to clean your
plugged needle and seat inside the carb, if it doesn't you need to
clean out the petcock, or put gas in the gas tank
>
>I don't know what year this is either, it's a blue one and he says
>there is no tag on the steering head.
>
>TIA
>
>JohnF
>
>
>
>On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 13:42:05 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
>wrote:
>
>>I'm trying to help repair a Mikuni carb from a 250 Blaster by phone. I
>>need a diagram of the carb to figure out what he is referring to when
>>we talk. Any online exploded views out there anywhere? I haven't found
>>one so far.
>>
>>JohnF
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455263 ] |
Tue, 27 September 2005 13:53 |
|
On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 11:35:25 -0600, IdaSpode <not [at] home_watching.tv>
wrote:
>On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 17:26:52 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
>wrote:
>
>>Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
>>found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
>>black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
>>bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
>>there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
>
>I don't know squat about Blasters, but here's an idea:
>
>Are there two hoses running off the petcock? Does the petcock have
>"ON-RES-PRI" positions only (no OFF)?
>
>If so, it is a vacuum operated petcock, needs vacuum from the engine
>to flow fuel. Try it in the PRI (prime) position, should flow w/o
>vacuum.
>
>Maybe Murray will jump in here, he just went through some issues with
>this type of petcock on his DR350.
Highly unlikely he has that type of petcock on a Quad, those are for
street bike application only I believe.
>
>>JohnF
>
>David - 05 KTM 200EXC
>djones<at>LSidaho.com
>http://www.spodefest.net/rmd
>http://www.spodefest.net/forum
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455377 ] |
Wed, 28 September 2005 02:18 |
|
On Tue, 27 Sep 2005 05:53:39 -0600, Murray <Murraynolonger [at] work.com>
wrote:
>On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 11:35:25 -0600, IdaSpode <not [at] home_watching.tv>
>wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 17:26:52 GMT, JohnF <mpi-brwNADA [at] phxinternet.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Does the fiche show any type of fuel flow shut-off inside the carb? I
>>>found some photos on EBay and the carb looks stock except for the
>>>black (alum colored) box on the top. He has no apparent fuel to the
>>>bowl and can't blow through the supply tube into the bowl. I ain't
>>>there and he knows just enough to be dangerous.
>>
>>I don't know squat about Blasters, but here's an idea:
>>
>>Are there two hoses running off the petcock? Does the petcock have
>>"ON-RES-PRI" positions only (no OFF)?
>>
>>If so, it is a vacuum operated petcock, needs vacuum from the engine
>>to flow fuel. Try it in the PRI (prime) position, should flow w/o
>>vacuum.
>>
>>Maybe Murray will jump in here, he just went through some issues with
>>this type of petcock on his DR350.
>
> Highly unlikely he has that type of petcock on a Quad, those are for
>street bike application only I believe.
I wasn't sure, those quads are 'tarded ya know...
>>
>>>JohnF
David - 05 KTM 200EXC
djones<at>LSidaho.com
http://www.spodefest.net/rmd
http://www.spodefest.net/forum
|
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| Re: Need info-- Mikuni carb Yamaha 250 Blaster [message #455518 ] |
Thu, 29 September 2005 01:50 |
|
I've had him do all the standard stuff to check for blockages. He had
the carb off and the bowl taken down to clean the fuzzzys out of the
jets. I had him spray Berrymans down the fuel line to see if it was
flowing at all but it wasn't. I looked at the Yamaha page and the carb
looks just like any other Mikuni since dirt so I have to assume there
is something in the float needle (small bird or the like) stopping the
flow. I'll be there tomorrow so I'll take a look.
Thanks for the help everybody.
JohnF
|
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|
